Hello all - new 2018 e-Golf owner (with charging question)

[manybees]

Hi all,

Got a great deal (almost $7000 under sticker price!) on a new 2018 e-Golf SEL Premium with DAP out here in the Boston area recently, and just took delivery of it last week. So far, I'm just loving this car -- and sometimes just driving around just to drive around in it. I've never owned an EV before, and everything about it so far is impressive. Just love how quiet, powerful, and refined the car feels. I've owned two other VWs in the ancient past ('77 Passat and '86 Golf diesel), and this new one is in a whole different universe of quality and features.

Also seriously considered the Chevy Bolt (mostly because of its range) but when it came down to it, my wife and I just liked the obviously better build quality and more polished and thoughtful interior and exterior of the e-Golf, despite its inferior range. The interior of the Bolt felt a bit on the cheap side (lots of hard plastic) and the seats were uncomfortable, and the car felt smaller somehow, even though I think the interiors have about the same available space. We also just liked the styling of the Golf way better -- just looks like a "regular" car that happens to be electric. We (and I'm sure many others who also might be in the market for an EV of any kind) are quite put off by the faux "futuristic" styling of the Bolt and the BMW i3 (and many other BEVs and PHEVs, including the entire Prius line). Why do car companies feel that they have to do weird, otherworldly designs for EVs, I wonder? I'd like to think I'm rational when making big decisions like this, but emotional reactions do enter into the decision. It'd be very hard for me to pay a major amount of money for something I find to be unattractive to look at every time I look out into my front driveway. So if the Bolt had actually looked anything at all like the e-Golf's stylish exterior, we might have gone the other way...

Anyway, I had a question about doing overnight scheduling via the Car-Net app. I need to set it up so that the charging starts at 9pm and ends at 5am the next day to take advantage of off-peak electric rates. When I go to set up the charging profiles, it says "Start time falls within same day of set departure time. To schedule the night rate timer for overnight charging, set start time to 12 AM." So am I correct in assuming that it's impossible to set up a single profile that will start charging at 9pm and end at 5am? Do I need to set up 2 profiles/schedules for this? One for 9pm-12pm and one for 12pm to 5am? If so, then the kludgy scheduling functionality for this app really needs a serious redesign.

Also, I don't see any feature to tie a GPS location to a specific charging schedule so that it automatically changes to that schedule when I'm at that location. I'm assuming that this simply doesn't exist, which is a sad thing. I see so much potential in this app that seems to be going untapped, but it appears from other posts here that just getting the basic functionality working was a long and arduous process to begin with... Oh well..

Thanks to all of you regular posters, here, btw. While I was researching this car and in my first week of ownership, I've been lurking on this forum, and it has provided me with much useful info.

 

[johnnylingo]

When I go to set up the charging profiles, it says "Start time falls within same day of set departure time. To schedule the night rate timer for overnight charging, set start time to 12 AM."

Setting two schedules should do the trick. The app was initially developed by Verizon and worked fine, but about year ago VW took it in-house and introduced several bugs and feature losses in process. Some people prefer to avoid it entirely and instead set departure times via car button -> e-manager which will delay charging. However, this has the shortcoming of not being aware of off-peak hours if you'd rather use low rates vs. having a full charge. Really, the best solution is get a programmable EVSE like a ChargePoint or JuiceBox where the schedule can be set on that unit itself. You may want to buy an L2 charger anyway since at 120V / 12A you'll only be able to charge 30% of the battery in that 8-hour window.

 

[manybees]

Really, the best solution is get a programmable EVSE like a ChargePoint or JuiceBox where the schedule can be set on that unit itself. You may want to buy an L2 charger anyway since at 120V / 12A you'll only be able to charge 30% of the battery in that 8-hour window.

I do plan to put in a Level 2 EVSE but I’m limited to having a max 16amp unit because that’s all our electrical service can handle. I’ve only been able to find a Clipper Creek LCS-20 from a reputable seller, but the LCS-20 doesn’t have the ability to set a schedule. Chargepoint mentions a 16amp version on their site, but they don’t seem to sell it anymore. Any other suggestions?

 

[BarryMW]

Give juicebox a call. I’ll bet they will set one to 16A for you.
I have two JBs and they share the available current so not to exceed my homes availability of 48A. 60A breaker x 80% = 48A limit.

Barry

 

[manybees]

@BarryMW - Thanks for the tip. I think I’ll give them a call and see if they can customize something for me.

 

[johnnylingo]

Chargepoint mentions a 16amp version on their site, but they don’t seem to sell it anymore. Any other suggestions?

I periodically see used ones on eBay. Sometimes it's just the charger, but it's easy to buy a new cord direct from ChargePoint. JuiceBox is a nice option too.

 

[JoulesThief]

You can go into "settings" on a Juicebox40 pro, and set the charge limit to 16 amps, and you'll be good to go.

 

[manybees]

You can go into "settings" on a JuiceBox40 pro, and set the charge limit to 16 amps, and you'll be good to go.

The Siemens Versicharge also has the same functionality of being able to stop down the amperage via dip switches. However, according to our building code, the breaker installed in the circuit box has to be able to deal with the maximum amperage setting of the device, so if you’ve got, say, a max 32 amp EVSE, then it needs a 40 amp breaker even if you set it internally to output, say, 16 amps. My (old) house’s electrical service can only handle a 20 amp, 240v circuit, hence my need for a 16 amp EVSE.

 

[manybees]

I periodically see used ones on eBay. Sometimes it's just the charger, but it's easy to buy a new cord direct from ChargePoint. JuiceBox is a nice option too.

Thanks for the tip. Hadn’t thought yet to check on eBay.

 

[BarryMW]

so if you’ve got, say, a max 32 amp EVSE, then it needs a 40 amp breaker even if you set it internally to output, say, 16 amps.

The maximum current from a device set to 16Amps is......... 16Amps.
Else the breaker pops to protect the wiring.

Are you sure about the code needing 40A ?


Barry

 

[Spektre]

so if you’ve got, say, a max 32 amp EVSE, then it needs a 40 amp breaker even if you set it internally to output, say, 16 amps.

The maximum current from a device set to 16Amps is......... 16Amps.
Else the breaker pops to protect the wiring.

Are you sure about the code needing 40A ?


Barry

Code requires that a continuous draw on a circuit be no greater than 80% of its max, ergo 40A breaker x 80% = 32A. My dryer circuit is 30A, the max by code I can continuously pull from it is 24A.

 

[Nick]

Welcome to the MA e-Golf owners group, which is pretty small compared to CA.

You should be able to achieve your charging objective in off-peak hours using the car's e-manager. Just set your departure time for 5 a.m. or whatever is the end of the off-peak hours.

 

[manybees]

Code requires that a continuous draw on a circuit be no greater than 80% of its max, ergo 40A breaker x 80% = 32A. My dryer circuit is 30A, the max by code I can continuously pull from it is 24A.

Yes. Exactly. If the device has a maximum setting of 32A continuous draw, then it requires a 40A breaker, even if the device is set to draw at a lower level. This is so that if the device's settings are ever changed in the future to draw its maximum load, then the circuit can still handle it.

Because I can only have a max 20A circuit installed, I can't put in a 32A EVSE because it would still require a 40A circuit even if it were stepped down to a lower amperage.

 

[manybees]

Welcome to the MA e-Golf owners group, which is pretty small compared to CA.

You should be able to achieve your charging objective in off-peak hours using the car's e-manager. Just set your departure time for 5 a.m. or whatever is the end of the off-peak hours.

Thanks, Nick! I've seen a few e-Golfs around MA -- but they are few and far between. Didn't find very many 2018s in stock at dealerships when I was shopping, so I don't think VW is pushing them very hard (definitely a compliance car in MA). It's unfortunate, as I think it's a great car (so far) and very fun to drive. Fit and finish are absolutely first rate. But I guess I shouldn't complain -- at least they're available in MA, and it appears that deals can be had for the 2018 SEL Premium with DAP (recently saw one advertised at $33,900 -- which means you could probably get it for even less than that).

The issue with the off-peak charging settings (following the Car-Net instructions) is that the off-peak charging start time has to be on the same day as the departure time, so if I want to charge from 9pm one day for a departure at 5am the next day, then there doesn't appear to be any way to do that without setting up two separate profiles and two separate schedules (one for 9pm-midnight, and one for midnight to 5am).

Am I missing something obvious? Or are we simply stuck with a kludgy design that will probably never change?

 

[BarryMW]

I can't put in a 32A EVSE because it would still require a 40A circuit even if it were stepped down to a lower amperage.

If that be true... then how can Emotorwerks (manu for JuiceBox) sell adaptors to change the 240V 40A plug on the JB to a smaller amperage plug.
They offer two 30A plugs and hell they even sell a 115V 15A adaptor << that's a clickable link to the product page.

I really think you should check the Code again.
Are you sure a 40A device drawing and limited to 16A is really a 40A device.

What if you purchased a 16A device that was upgradable to 40A via software.

 

[user 1485]

Welcome to the e-Golf club! Sounds like a heck of a deal on a 2018 (I didn't even know they were making 2018s!). For what it's worth I just bought a $200, 13 Amp cable on Amazon and I love it so far. I would think you could fully charge overnight with that, in the unlikely event that you're draining your entire battery each day.

I've also read time and again that the lower current you charge with the better for the overall life of the battery (something us purchasers have to think about), which is why I grabbed the 13 Amp cable, even though I have a 30 Amp outlet.

 

[manybees]

Welcome to the e-Golf club! Sounds like a heck of a deal on a 2018 (I didn't even know they were making 2018s!). For what it's worth I just bought a $200, 13 Amp cable on Amazon and I love it so far. I would think you could fully charge overnight with that, in the unlikely event that you're draining your entire battery each day.

I've also read time and again that the lower current you charge with the better for the overall life of the battery (something us purchasers have to think about), which is why I grabbed the 13 Amp cable, even though I have a 30 Amp outlet.

Thanks for the tip. I've heard as well that the lower power charging is better for the long term life of the battery. I've also read on this forum that you should only charge to 80-90% capacity most of the time, and that that will help to preserve the life of the battery in the long run. Will be interesting to see how it all plays out over the years.

The price I got on the 2018 SEL Premium with DAP seems to be pretty good, as far as I can tell. The VW sales guy said that there were $4000 in factory incentives on the 2018 SEL Premium models plus he offered 0% financing, which was his initial offer. I countered with $8000 off sticker and said I was ready to buy tomorrow from him if he accepted. Also mentioned that I'd gotten a lower price from another Boston-area dealer, but that I'd rather stick with him since he had showed me the car. He came back almost immediately with around $6500 off sticker, and I took it. Maybe I could have bargained him a bit lower, but oh well... Will get the $7500 federal tax credit next year plus an additional $2500 cash rebate from the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, so subtract another $10000 off the final price. Plus my local electric utility will give me a $250 rebate when I install a Level 2 EVSE. So not bad overall, in my view.

It's always such a black art to figure out what kind of deal a dealership will cut for you because there are so many pricing variables that we don't know about at a dealership that are unrelated to the actual price the dealer paid for the vehicle. But one thing I do know is that the sticker price is usually little more than the dealer's fantasy price, even for cars that are in short supply like the e-Golf.

 

[miimura]

Any AC charging on the e-Golf, no matter the speed, will be gentle on the battery. The only time you need to consider how fast you're charging is on DC Fast Charge. The slower 24kW DC chargers are certainly gentler on the battery and some consider that to the the fastest that you should charge the 2015/2016 e-Golf with the 24kWh battery pack. The e-Golf (all versions) can charge as fast as 45kW on the "50kW" fast chargers. Not all these "50kW" chargers are the same. Some are limited to 100 amps, which will give only up to 36kW charging speed on an e-Golf. I would personally not hesitate to charge a 2017/2018 e-Golf on those 100 amp chargers because the charging rate is 1C or a peak rate of 36kW into the 36kWh pack.

 

[f1geek]

1. Good luck finding a working Chargepoint 24 kW DCFC station - most of them (in CA, at least) are broken. And when they do work, sometimes they only deliver 10-11kW. Chargepoint DCFCs SUCK!
2. I've never seen 45 kW on either my 24.2 kWh or 35.8 kWh e-Golf. I just stopped at the Prunedale, CA DCFC Recargo station (has 6 200kW capable stations) and the best charge rate I saw was 39 kW (115 amps, 339 volts - when it began charging around 50% SOC). As the voltage increased, the amps dropped so the charge rate tapered and was 34 kW at 70% SOC). I agree lower C rates are gentler on the pack. The best rate I saw on my 2015 was 43 kW.

 

[johnnylingo]

Any AC charging on the e-Golf, no matter the speed, will be gentle on the battery.

This has matched my experience. I spent the first year mostly charging with the L1 trickle charger at 120/12 and second year using my ChargePoint home system. Neither year has produced any battery degradation. I calculated my estimated capacity today and came up with 22.2 kWh.