Few questions/concerns before deciding on the e-Golf

[badoix]

Hi all,
This forum is tremendously useful.. has made our decision to go for an EV a lot easier! Still, I have a few questions/concerns about the 2015 e-Golf that I'm hoping to get answered before we lease one..

1) Delayed charging:
I will be absolutely dependent on charging at home, so I need this to work reliably. As far as I can tell, the updates to Car-Net have fixed this issue *except* for those using the Clipper Creek EVSEs. I am planning to get a JuiceBox 30... can someone confirm if they've actually used this (or the Juicebox 40) with the e-Golf and that the delayed charging feature works fine? And is Car-Net indeed free for 3 yrs?

2) Charge port lock:
As far as I can tell, this is an issue for those who charge often in public charging spots and need others to be able to swap out the charging cord without unlocking the vehicle. Is that correct? I will almost exclusively be charging at home, so I don't see this as a major issue for us...

3) Reliability issues:
I saw that there are a few (<10?) cases of serious safety hazards caused by the car suddenly turning off when driving, which are concerning of course but seem rare. There are also a few reports of smaller issues (AC, etc) and things breaking... other than Car-Net, is this car reliable?

4) Interior space, especially in the back:
We are planning to put two toddler car seats in the back.. any e-Golf owners out there with kids in the back? How's the space with two car seats, and is it easy for the kids to get in and out?

We test-drove the e-Golf and the LEAF, and I thought the e-Golf drove way better and had much nicer interiors. However, it seems the LEAF has things definitely figured out in terms of delayed charging, it seems roomier, and is certainly cheaper. Any other opinions or comparisons of e-Golf vs. LEAF? Would be great to hear other points or counterpoints.

Thanks!
badoix

 

[jmmurphy26]

Lots of great commentary on eGolf vs. Leaf here: http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=20303 and here: http://www.myvwegolf.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2803#p2803. There are additional links in the eGolf forum post that i found really useful.

I haven't leased yet, but did a test drive of the eGolf with my toddler and I in the backseat, salesman and wife up front. There seemed to be plenty of room for my daughter and she had no problem getting in and out. Also the latches for the car seat were super convenient in the eGolf compared to my current vehicles.

I can't compare car seat spacing, etc. to the Leaf as we didn't get to test drive it (see posts...very frustrating).

Not sure where you are located, but lease deals are cheaper for the eGolf in CT. I called three Nissan dealers, told them what the VW offer was and asked if they could match or beat it and they all scoffed at me in disbelief. Also the 2016 eGolf SE is going to be comparably priced to the Leaf S, both will require "charging packages" to utilize Level 2 charging. However for the eGolf, the availability and cost of this package is uncertain at this point.

Hope this helps,

Aspiring EV Lesee

 

[formerdieselrumbler]

Greetings badoix. I've had my e-Golf for just about 8,000 miles now, and feel like I can contribute to most of your questions:

1) I can't comment on the delayed charging because I just don't use it.

2) I have only charged away from my house maybe 3 times, so the charge port lock is not a major issue for me. It is an annoying minor issue for me though. I typically charge my car overnight, so the car goes into a sleep mode after the charging completes. This is great for energy efficiency, but it means that my first unlock command in the morning simply wakes it up from sleep, and doesn't actually unlock the port. The car seems to wake up and say, "Oh, good morning! Hey, my charger is plugged in- maybe I should start charging again." At which point I need to wait a few seconds, and then click the unlock button again. Only then can I disengage the charger. I've gotten it down to unlocking when I walk out of my house (we have an external garage a few steps away from the house), then unlocking again when I'm at the car and ready to actually pull the plug. Annoying, but not a deal breaker.

3) Fortunately, I haven't had any of the sudden shutoffs that others have reported. I have reached out to my dealer to ask some questions about what happens when the power is completely lost, and haven't gotten very good responses. For example, I'm slightly concerned that no one can tell me what to expect from the electronic parking brake (no one calls it an emergency brake any more :? ) when the car loses all power. It seems that power is needed to keep the parking brake disengaged, so that a spring mechanism of some sort will engage the brakes when all power is lost- a sort of failsafe design. Of course, this is all conjecture. I also had a small issue with my AC once the weather got warm, but it was fixed with a software update at the dealer. If I could purchase the car new again, knowing what I know now, I'd specifically ask the dealer to apply all software updates that are available at the time of delivery. Seems like this should have been done anyway.

4) There is a good bit of interior space. We use a child booster seat for our 7 year old in the back, and I have little doubt that there would be any problems with 2 child seats. Three may be pushing it. I'd see if the dealer would let you install your child seats in a Golf as a test.

When I had to part with my e-Golf for a day to get the AC fixed, they loaned me a 1 year old ICE Jetta. When my salesperson asked me how I liked that car upon return, I told her, "When I drive my e-Golf, there are very few other cars on the road that cost less than $100k that I'd trade with (Tesla definitely, and maybe a Cayman S, or M3). When I was driving the ICE Jetta, I would have traded with most of the other cars I saw on the road."

Good luck, and we hope you become a part of our community soon!

 

[vetaldj]

Hi,
Here's my few cents:

1. Never used that, always charge outside my home

2. Port lock, well, I charge at work and I always take my car out as soon as it''s ready. Still sometime I've got note that it's not nice to lock charger (and I've got it from people who never bother to come and take car out...). Well, problem is that in my place people not respect each other - as soon as they park they try to pull your plug out no matter if you charged or not. I'm probably one of few who actually like that car is locking charger because of that.

3. I have triangle with words electrical failure once, right after I finished charging and start my car. Turn it off, back on - never happen again. This thing is worry me too as I always drive on busy freeway with no spots to pull over pretty much...

4. Back space is Ok for two seats, I will make a picture today. Expect that kids will kick back of the seats, but it's small car anyway, they can reach back seat of my X5 as well... Overall it's pretty roomier inside, bigger then previous Golf I've owned (2014).

Thanks!

 

[TEConnor]

1) I have had success with delayed charging using my Siemens Lvl 2. I did the 12V disconnect ('reboot') trick, which is simple and may not be necessary, to get Car-net functioning. This, combined with my more recent Car acquisition (April), appears to have done the trick. I will say that there are improvements that could be made w/ the Car-net experience and delayed charging, but now that I understand it, I can make it work well enough for me.

2) I charge all over the place and have used most types of public chargers. This charge lock thing is annoying at a minimum and possibly a major issue for certain charger types/shapes (a small minority of units, apparently). I was able to undo the charger lock mechanism (there's a thread about it) relatively easily and I'm happy that I did. Also, my Siemens charger is immune to locking (because the trigger/clip is shallow and doesn't reach the locking mechanism pin), so there's that. Overall, based on your indications of primarily home charging, this shouldn't be of much consequence to you. Also, there's a chance that VW might fix this with the 2016 (one would hope...it would be top of my list).

3) We had 1 shutdown that was, thankfully, no biggie. The power button is in a terrible place. I think a percentage of shutdowns are because of that (as ours was when my wife pressed the button inadvertently when stowing a purse/wallet), but the seemingly random power shutdowns are concerning, but thankfully apparently rare. We are 2200 miles into our lease and have had great performance and reliability. I recommend this car to everyone I know. I'm with the poster above who said that there are few cars on the road I'd switch with. I was following a Maserati yesterday on a windy forest parkway...just for fun, I was sort-of tailing...really gripping the eGolf on the turns and generally popping the accelerator at the few stops...when we split at a fork, the driver gave me a strange look, then a nod. This is a pretty darn nice sports car.

4) We have a 7 yr old who's in a booster. She can sit behind me without problems. I'm tall and generally this is an issue in all cars. We've had a rear facing childseat in the other side and her on my side a few times and it is much more spacious than our previous Subaru, our current Countryman, and about equivalent to our old 2010 Prius. Plus we regularly sit two 7 yr olds and one skinny adult across the back. To do three car seats, I think one would need to be a 'bubble bum' in the middle...which is an inflatable booster (inexpensive things...nice to have for travel/sharing). First thing most folks comment on when inside is the 'roominess'. It was about 1/4 of the decision point for me as I felt less space in the LEAF. I will say that the trunk is very nice as well, we took 2 weeks of luggage for 3 in it to the airport a few weeks back...no problem. However, if you want golf clubs in a cart bag to fit, you have to take the woods out and lay them across the top...small issue.

Cheers,
Tim

 

[badoix]

Thanks for the responses so far. I'll look through the links, they seem really useful.

Just to add a few details: we're in the SF Bay Area. I need a car asap, so waiting for the 2016 models is not an option. I suppose this discussion properly belongs to the 'leasing' thread, but just as a note, the best price I'm getting (before any haggling) are -
LEAF - 3200 down out the door, 149 + tax/month
e-Golf - 2500 down out the door, 205 + tax/month

With the $2500 CA rebate, the down payment is almost refunded.

Any specific comments on delayed charging with the Juicebox EVSEs?

 

[miimura]

Any specific comments on delayed charging with the Juicebox EVSEs?

Don't expect the JuiceBox Pro internal timer (or an internal timer in any EVSE) to work with the e-Golf. This feature is usually implemented by leaving the Pilot signal (allowable amp draw) dark until the station's start time arrives. The e-Golf will have gone to sleep and will not notice when the pilot signal comes alive. It would require opening the Proximity pin and then re-closing it to simulate a plug-out/plug-in event to wake up the car. Most J1772 cables don't have enough wires to do this.

When using the car's timer, it should not matter what EVSE you use. It's baffling to me that the Clipper Creek HCS-40 doesn't work with the car's timer for some people.

Regarding cabin space - my standard back seat test for any car is to set the driver's seat for myself (5'11" with long-ish legs) and then sit in the seat behind. If my knees have clearance, it passes. The e-Golf does pass this test. We have a 6 year old that uses a high back booster with 5 point belts and she is very comfortable. However, the cloth seats in the LE show dust from little feet very readily, especially on the back of the front seats. My daughter knows better than to put her shoes on the back of the seats. My nephew, not so much.

 

[badoix]

Thanks for the info, miimura.

I guess my question was whether the Car-Net delayed charging feature (through 'departure time' setting and not through 'Off-Peak' hrs as has been mentioned on this forum) has been verified to work with the JuiceBox basic chargers. I do not intend to get a Pro charger.

I agree that it's baffling why the Clipper Creek L2 EVSEs wouldn't work when others do (and their own L1 chargers do). I spoke with Clipper Creek tech support and he agreed it's baffling. His best guess was that the third party involved (Car-Net) may somehow be complicating matters.

As an aside, it's a rare pleasure to call up companies like Clipper Creek and Juicebox and speak directly to a live, knowledgeable person without even having to navigate a standard answering menu

badoix

 

[garypen]

Just to add a few details: we're in the SF Bay Area. I need a car asap, so waiting for the 2016 models is not an option. I suppose this discussion properly belongs to the 'leasing' thread, but just as a note, the best price I'm getting (before any haggling) are -
LEAF - 3200 down out the door, 149 + tax/month
e-Golf - 2500 down out the door, 205 + tax/month

Is it "down" or "out the door"? Generally the two are different.

When dealers advertise $2500 down, it generally doesn't include sales tax (on pre fed tax credit amount), DMV, and dealer doc fees, which can add around $1500 or so.

Also, are those numbers for 7500 or 10,000/yr leases? VW dealers really pus the 7500/yr leases in ads, as they are cheap, and draw people in.

 

[sweetwagon]

Yes, car-net departure charging works fine with Juicebox.

I guess my question was whether the Car-Net delayed charging feature (through 'departure time' setting and not through 'Off-Peak' hrs as has been mentioned on this forum) has been verified to work with the JuiceBox basic chargers. I do not intend to get a Pro charger.
badoix

 

[badoix]

Garypen - you're right, sorry about the lack of clarity. I have been emailing dealers asking for quotes with a payment of 2500 'out the door' - including taxes, title, licensing, dealer fees, first payment, etc. Obviously because that makes the payment $0 after CA rebate. I am a little skeptical about whether their promise of 2500 out the door will be kept. I suppose I should ask for a full worksheet before I actually make a trip to sign the lease?

The numbers I quoted were for a 3 yr, 12000 miles/yr lease. The best quotes I got so far -
on LE - 205 + tax (Hayward VW)
on SEL - 216 + tax (Sunnyvale VW)

I think there may actually be better deals on the SEL in the coming months as there is a LOT of inventory (Oakland VW has 45 SELs in the lot, but no LEs) and the 2015 model may become less desirable with the coming 2016 updates to both the e-Golf and the LEAF.

Sweetwagon - thanks for the confirmation about Juicebox working with e-Golf!

 

[garypen]

Garypen - you're right, sorry about the lack of clarity. I have been emailing dealers asking for quotes with a payment of 2500 'out the door' - including taxes, title, licensing, dealer fees, first payment, etc. Obviously because that makes the payment $0 after CA rebate. I am a little skeptical about whether their promise of 2500 out the door will be kept. I suppose I should ask for a full worksheet before I actually make a trip to sign the lease?

The numbers I quoted were for a 3 yr, 12000 miles/yr lease. The best quotes I got so far -
on LE - 205 + tax (Hayward VW)
on SEL - 216 + tax (Sunnyvale VW)

I think there may actually be better deals on the SEL in the coming months as there is a LOT of inventory (Oakland VW has 45 SELs in the lot, but no LEs) and the 2015 model may become less desirable with the coming 2016 updates to both the e-Golf and the LEAF.

Sweetwagon - thanks for the confirmation about Juicebox working with e-Golf!

I think that $2500 is probably before taxes and fees. But, I could be wrong.
If it's truly 2500 OTD and $216/mo, you should jump on it. Also, the SEL is easily worth the few more dollars than the LE.

 

[Electrikarma]

If they're quoting you only $11/month more for the SEL compared to the LE, I would jump on it.

For your reference, I leased my LE in July for $1900 down OTD, and $221 (tax included) per month for 3 years, 12000 miles per year.

I agree with the others, that when people throw out "SEL lease for $189/month", you need to know how much of a check you are writing at the beginning of the lease, or else that "$189" is almost meaningless.

 

[badoix]

Electrikarma - thanks for sharing those numbers. That sounds like a sweet deal. I am basically shooting for that (or perhaps lower since it's later in the year for the 2015 models). Was this in CA? If so can you share which dealer you got it from?

 

[SfEvR]

Hi all,
This forum is tremendously useful.. has made our decision to go for an EV a lot easier! Still, I have a few questions/concerns about the 2015 e-Golf that I'm hoping to get answered before we lease one..

1) Delayed charging:
I will be absolutely dependent on charging at home, so I need this to work reliably. As far as I can tell, the updates to Car-Net have fixed this issue *except* for those using the Clipper Creek EVSEs. I am planning to get a JuiceBox 30... can someone confirm if they've actually used this (or the Juicebox 40) with the e-Golf and that the delayed charging feature works fine? And is Car-Net indeed free for 3 yrs?

2) Charge port lock:
As far as I can tell, this is an issue for those who charge often in public charging spots and need others to be able to swap out the charging cord without unlocking the vehicle. Is that correct? I will almost exclusively be charging at home, so I don't see this as a major issue for us...

3) Reliability issues:
I saw that there are a few (<10?) cases of serious safety hazards caused by the car suddenly turning off when driving, which are concerning of course but seem rare. There are also a few reports of smaller issues (AC, etc) and things breaking... other than Car-Net, is this car reliable?

4) Interior space, especially in the back:
We are planning to put two toddler car seats in the back.. any e-Golf owners out there with kids in the back? How's the space with two car seats, and is it easy for the kids to get in and out?

We test-drove the e-Golf and the LEAF, and I thought the e-Golf drove way better and had much nicer interiors. However, it seems the LEAF has things definitely figured out in terms of delayed charging, it seems roomier, and is certainly cheaper. Any other opinions or comparisons of e-Golf vs. LEAF? Would be great to hear other points or counterpoints.

Thanks!
badoix

Others have already given pretty good responses, but I figured I'd chime in as well in case it's useful.

1) No idea if Juicebox has delay charging issues. I have a Siemens, and the issue has been 100% resolved for me after the long awaited update that finally came a few months ago. Delay works like a charm now. In general, carnet is crap, their customer service don't know anything about the e-golf. But the delay charging works now, which is the main feature I care about. VW Customer Care reps on the other hand have been great and very responsive;

2) Charge port lock is what it is. Not an issue for me since I mainly charge at home. Hopefully they'll do a software update one day to allow folks to disable it when it's appropriate;

3) I've had the car since November 2014 and it has been super reliable. None of the charging/shut down issues some have reported. Compared to the i3, it seems the number of issues have been minor and only a few users. I suspect this is pretty typical of a new car model, that there are some bugs and also that a small segment of the cars have more major issues.

4) the interior space in the car is fantastic for its exterior footprint. In terms of your backseat question, it is plenty roomy. All summer, we carpooled three 7 year olds. We had one high back booster, one low back booster, and a bubble bum in the middle. No problem with three young children in the back. I haven't tried toddler seats in it, but I'd think two would easily fit with no issue. Surprisingly, the back seat of the e-Golf is roomier than our 2003 Subaru Forester.

Overall, I've loved this car over our almost 9 months of ownership. It's fun to drive, cheap to operate, and has performed even better than I expected. Am extremely happy with my EV choice. We didn't look at the Leaf because of the partial frontal impact crash test that it completely failed last summer. That was enough to persuade me not to even consider the LEAF. I don't know if Nissan has resolved that issue for the new model year. Hope this helps.

 

[Electrikarma]

This was Norm Reeves in Irvine.

Given that it's already September, you should get even better pricing if there are any LE left. If not, even the SEL should be discounted heavily, or else get a 2016 if you can wait a little bit longer.

 

[chencezann]

Electrikarma,

I was talking with Norm Reeves in Irvine last week, trying to see what numbers we could work with to make it work out. They still have a lot of inventory (especially LEs which I want) around.

If you wouldn't mind sharing your experience working with them, and who you worked with? If you had a great experience I'd love to work with the same folks.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Electrikarma]

The salesman I dealt with was Andrei Maldareanu. Pretty straightforward. I sent an email with my offer, at first he did not honor that offer, then a few days later said that his manager accepted my offer. I came in, did a quick test drive, filled out paperwork and wrapped it up all in about 2 hours.

 

[badoix]

Thanks everyone on this post for your replies and extremely useful feedback! They helped us make the decision to go for the e-Golf.

We leased our silver LE on Sunday! We got it from Oakland VW (Kaj Pedersen was very honest and a pleasure to deal with) for $210/mo (including tax) after $2500 total out the door for 3 yr/36000 miles. Not as good as Electrikarma got in Irvine (about 200 more in total cost over 3 years) but that's the best I could negotiate

For comparison, they were offering the SEL for $240/mo. including tax. The extra $30 a month is probably worth it (for the leather and nicer wheels?) but it pushed it over what we were willing to spend.

L2 charger to be installed next week.. hopefully it works!

 

[SfEvR]

Thanks everyone on this post for your replies and extremely useful feedback! They helped us make the decision to go for the e-Golf.

We leased our silver LE on Sunday! We got it from Oakland VW (Kaj Pedersen was very honest and a pleasure to deal with) for $210/mo (including tax) after $2500 total out the door for 3 yr/36000 miles. Not as good as Electrikarma got in Irvine (about 200 more in total cost over 3 years) but that's the best I could negotiate

For comparison, they were offering the SEL for $240/mo. including tax. The extra $30 a month is probably worth it (for the leather and nicer wheels?) but it pushed it over what we were willing to spend.

L2 charger to be installed next week.. hopefully it works!

Congratulations and welcome to the club! It's really a great car. I have an SEL, but only because the LE wasn't out yet when I got mine. Had it been, I probably wouldn't have splurged for the SEL either (though I'm happy with it). In the inner cooler ring of the bay area (I'm in the Berkeley area) the heat pump is not really needed, which I see as the biggest functional perk of the SEL.