Car-net and delayed charging

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Joined
Nov 23, 2014
Messages
45
Got an opportunity to try out delayed charging last night.
Set the departure time to 6:30am, off peak power on (12A-5A) and all other settings were set.
Plugged in the charger (Siemens). The car's delayed charging button went on, the charger showed it was on and ready.
This morning, no charge.

Any suggestions?
 
in2insight said:
Got an opportunity to try out delayed charging last night.
Set the departure time to 6:30am, off peak power on (12A-5A) and all other settings were set.
Plugged in the charger (Siemens). The car's delayed charging button went on, the charger showed it was on and ready.
This morning, no charge.

Any suggestions?
We've used the departure time feature to set up a delayed charge, and so far it has worked. To be honest, I'm not impressed with the usability of the app and the fact that the US e-Golf doesn't have the "Pro" version of the infotainment system which (to me is astonishing) is lacking the ability to set it up in the car without the app. Also, as of now, the online version of Car-Net (from a computer), is also lacking the function to set the time of charge. I digress...

Although we haven't had an issue yet setting up the charging, it is rather confusing, even for engineer/computer programmer, so I have no doubt that people might have some issues. A few things come to mind that might mess up the charging:

Did you wait for and see the green banner at the top of the app that confirms the car received the settings you changed? I've been impatient a few times and clicked on a text or just closed the app, and discovered later that the request never went through. I have also seen a red banner indicating that the request failed, prompting me to resend the request.

Perhaps double check the times of charging in the app, and check that the car has the right time. Our car came from the factory with the wrong time zone set (so it looked like the right time, but was 8 hours or so off, which might mess up how the car handles requests across time-zones, but I'm not sure if it even is an issue since I corrected the time zone right away).

Make sure the little plug icon is not greyed out in the app under the e-manager: Charging, or the Departure Time. Also, the Charging tab should show the upcoming departure time if it is set for the next morning (or in the next 24 hours, depending on when it's set for). For instance, mine shows that the car is plugged in a ready to charge (not charging now), and below that it shows the plug icon and the departure time for tomorrow morning at 7:00 am (I set that for everyday which is the end of the off-peak rate we have with PG&E, so that it would charge as much as possible at the cheapest times - I also have it set for "off-peak power" under the "Charging locations" tab).

Also make sure that the plug and outlet are all set with a solid connection, no fault lights and a solid circuit. I once plugged in the car, walked away, and later discovered I hadn't plugged it in to the car solidly, which gave a fault. I also make sure the locking mechanism is engaged after locking the car for the night, just to be sure it's in all the way.

Lastly, under the Charging Locations tab (under Departure time tab), you'll want to be sure that the current rating for the EVSE you're using is accurate. I haven't tested this, but I have a feeling that this setting has to do with calculating the amount of time the car thinks it needs, so if the setting is higher than your circuit can give, you may end up with the car thinking it can charge faster, and delay charging too long. And finally, you'll want to double check the Maximum charge level setting to be sure it's set for 100% (or whatever else you want it at).

Also, I'm not sure which Siemens model EVSE you have, but if there are user-selectable settings on that, make sure you have the right time. AM/PM, charge times, etc. As far as I know, Siemens only has a "plug-and-go" option without other functions, so this may be a moot point.

Hopefully it's a simple fix. Like I said earlier, I'm a little frustrated with the level of user-friendlienes the app has. And I hope the online version adds functionality soon. I'm not holding my breath for an infotainment update, so for now, we're stuck with the Car-Net app for this.

-Rachel
 
Rachel,
Thank you for the detailed response. Yeah, pretty wild that some of the EU options are missing here.
Your post made me think that I should look at all options on each screen, and sure enough, there is a setting option of one that has the Min. % to charge to (as opposed to the Max. % to charge to on another screen...) and mine was set to 30%, which would explain why it did not charge (The care was at 37%.)

The app and the web portal need a LOT of TLC. :)

Cheers,
Dorian
 
in2insight said:
Rachel,
Thank you for the detailed response. Yeah, pretty wild that some of the EU options are missing here.
Your post made me think that I should look at all options on each screen, and sure enough, there is a setting option of one that has the Min. % to charge to (as opposed to the Max. % to charge to on another screen...) and mine was set to 30%, which would explain why it did not charge (The care was at 37%.)

The app and the web portal need a LOT of TLC. :)

Cheers,
Dorian
I too was curious about the "minimum charge" setting, so I looked it up. It turns out that it's a setting that actually starts the charging immediately, even if you have it set for delayed charging, up to the level you set (e.g., 30%), but only if the battery is lower than that threshold. So if you have it set to 30%, and you come home with 10% battery left, it will charge immediately up to 30%, then stop, and wait for the delayed charging to finish the charge up to the maximum charge you have set. So setting the minimum charge will not accomplish a delayed charge on its own, but will give you some charge if for some reason it doesn't start the delayed charge.

-Rachel
 
I too am very unsettled that the US based e-golf got the low resolution screen, but I assumed it would still have the same functionality the euro cars do.... but they don't. I also called Car-net last week to complain about the app and let them know most people want a 'set time to charge' option as opposed to the dumb 'time of departure' way.... I just want to come home, plug in and then have the car start to charge after 11pm, (with a level 2 charger) so set to charge at 11:05pm.
But as it stands now I get home, plug-in, push the delay charge button on the car, then set an alarm for 11:05 pm on my iPhone to start charging, then either use the app or go to the garage and hit start charging.
I only use the time of departure for the climate control.
Car-net seems open to the idea, and said they would contact me back when they have it ready to go. But it sounds like it would be rolled into car-net 2.0 .....whenever that happens...
I'm hoping more people contact them to complain about this and the general slowness so that they make it happen sooner, or at least VW makes them put it in sooner.....
 
So, I started out hopeful that I had figured out the delayed charging, and had it working for a couple weeks, but just as I was becoming complacent (and not double checking to make sure that it actually stared charging at night), I woke up this morning with no more charge than I left it with. Oddly, I even checked last night to make sure that the app indicated that it was ready to charge, and that my departure time was at 7am, but still no delayed charge.

So, I've concluded - and I tend to take a fairly pragmatic approach to problems - that there are significant bugs, or at the very least, a very confusing and user-unfriendly interface, coupled with the fact with there is no way to reliably confirm that the car is actually going to charge. The complete lack of the interface in the in-car infotainment system was a very big disappointment to me, as I imagine with many EV owners. Seeing as home charging is by far the most common way to "fuel" up these cars, this should have been a big priority for VW. Also, I can't understand why the online version of Car-Net is crippled with no option to set charge times or departure times.

That said, I know this is VW's first US attempt at an EV, but given that the EU model has the infotainment upgrades, I find it shameful that it was left out of the US version. As a tech geek and early adopter, I understand that perfection is not possible, but I feel like VW dropped the ball on this one (we have a plug-in hybrid as well, with a far superior in-car menu, and app). First EV VW in the US, but they've been making EV's for long enough that we shouldn't end up with such significant bugs. I can only hope that they are able to fix these issues very soon. When you rely on charging to make your car go (and get to work, etc.), there isn't much room for a half-baked attempts.

Sorry for the rant... anyone have any other ideas for making the delayed charging more reliable?

-Rachel
 
Rachel,

I have zero electrical background, so this may sound silly - but would it be possible to put the electrical plug/junction box that the EVSE is hooked up to on a "timer" - kind of like a suped up Xmas light timer for 240V? See the link from Amazon below:

http://www.amazon.com/Intermatic-HB114C-Heavy-Appliance-Timer/dp/B000AY1KKA

Let me know what you think?

John
 
LAeGolf said:
Rachel,

I have zero electrical background, so this may sound silly - but would it be possible to put the electrical plug/junction box that the EVSE is hooked up to on a "timer" - kind of like a suped up Xmas light timer for 240V? See the link from Amazon below:

http://www.amazon.com/Intermatic-HB114C-Heavy-Appliance-Timer/dp/B000AY1KKA

Let me know what you think?

John
John, I would strongly advise against that. First off, a timer device like that is rated at 5kW, which would be exceeded if you have a 30A circuit and the car draws the 24A it should for that circuit. Secondly, most EVSE's would rather stay plugged in to monitor parameters in the car (the pilot signal and proximity circuits for instance), and even though the full AC current isn't flowing to the car when it's set for delayed charging, there is a very small amount of energy used for "communication" between the EVSE and the car so they both are on the same page in terms of how much energy to use, what faults might necessitate stopping the current, etc. So for that reason, it's advisable to have the EVSE plugged into the mains if it's plugged into the car. Also, some EVSE's don't like being plugged into the car first, then mains outlet (which is effectively what this timer does). For some, this will throw a fault that would need to be reset by unplugging the car and plugging back in, which defeats the purpose altogether.

Your idea isn't silly (if it could work it would be a great inexpensive solution), but it's not a solution that would work well for EV charging. A much better solution is either to have an EVSE that is time controllable, of which there are several, or simply to have VW fix the bugs in the system.

After that, what I'd like to see, just like Ford does, would be to have profiles for various charging locations based on the GPS in the car. In our other car (Ford Fusion plug-in hybrid), when you park it, it takes note of the location and cross references that with pre-assigned charging spots (home, office, etc.) and allows you to set when it starts charging, when it stops charging and when your departure time is in the morning. So, I come home, plug it in and walk away, and because it knows that I just parked at home, it automatically waits until 11pm to start charging. At work, it's set to start charging right away, so it does. After I set it the first time, it has charged correctly every time. It even reminds me if I forget to plug it in if it knows it has a delayed charge coming up. Beyond that, it even knows the off-peak times without my input after selecting our power company from a drop down list. Ford's app isn't perfect, and it's interface is a little goofy, but it's functionality is far beyond VW at the moment.

-Rachel
 
Thanks for clearing that up. With the e-Golf only on the market a month, hopefully someone from VW will start monitoring these blogs, and listen to owner feedback. It souds like a software issue only, and can be patched with an update.

You think the timer could work with the 110v trickle charger that came with the car, since it's power draw is so much less? It's very slow, only 4 miles per hour of charging, but still... over 8 hours at night let's say - 4 x 8 x 365 = 11,680 per year. I know it defeats the purpose of having a 30A charger, but till they fix the issue maybe?
 
To anyone reading this thread thinking of buying an EVSE unit that doesn't have a delayed charging feature built in...DON'T.

We were early adopters (leased Blue eGolf in Nov)and went with the VW suggested Bosch Power Xpress unit. it work fine and the narrow footprint fit the location in our garage well.

But....until it was installed in Dec we didn't realize that the carnet app doesn't work so are having to recharge the car at rates 3x that of being able to charge between midnight and 6am pst when the SC Edison rate is only 10c/KwHr. This is a commuter car so it gets recharged daily.

In hindsight we would have purchased a different EVSE, we're trying to get VW to correct this but it is slow going and every day costs us more in electricity.
 
The issue seems to be that the car itself goes into "sleep" mode and neither the app nor a charger with delayed charging can wake it up.
I'm playing with how long it takes for the car to stop responding.
So far, any "delay" over 2 hours yields a car not being charged
 
in2insight said:
The issue seems to be that the car itself goes into "sleep" mode and neither the app nor a charger with delayed charging can wake it up.
I'm playing with how long it takes for the car to stop responding.
So far, any "delay" over 2 hours yields a car not being charged

Thanks for the post...like every other issue we're having with the carnet software, owners seem to know more than VW or the carnet " technical help".

I thought I read earlier that someone else had successfully used a EVSE unit with delay to overcome the carnet failure. But to your point, if correct, it may be that persons car wasn't asleep for the 2+hours.

So if I understand what you are saying, we can plug the car in at 10.02 PM and the delay feature will then work to start at midnight.

Will try it out tonight and see what happens, still a software bug, but a bit more usable than staying up until midnight to plug it in!
 
Here is an idea that I will try and test --- seems the issue is that the car goes to sleep after about 2 hours -- what if one created 4 different schedules to try and keep the car "awake" till the lower tiered electric rate times comes around. Here is what I'm thinking:

Schedule 1 - plug the car in at 9pm - set the minimum charge to 2% higher than your current state of charge; so if you got home with 23% remaining, set the charge level at 25% (yes, you're wasting 2% charge at a higher electric rate, but it will keep the car "awake")

Schedule 2 - set departure time for 10:30 pm - and 27% charge

Schedule 3 - set departure time for 11:30 pm - and 29% charge

Schedule 4 - set departure time for 2:30 am - and 80% charge (since the charge from 29% to 80% should take about 2 hours, it should start after midnight, at the lower electric tier rate).

I understand that the correct solution would be for VW and Car-Net to fix the delayed charging issue; but in the meantime, as a group we may be able to come up with a workaround solution.
 
Wanted to share my own experiences with this, I would love to figure out a solution.

Delayed charging has never worked, but the climate control does turn on at the desired departure time (this seems very reliable).

I've set up delayed charging with both the iPhone app and also with the website. I'm using the 110V OEM charger.

I'm in CA. I have off peak power set for 11pm to 7am. I have the departure time typically set for 8am.

Last night, the batteries needed about 11 hours of charge. However despite showing the timed charging indicator, when the plug was put in it would not turn on. I reinserted the plug at around 10pm to wake it up, and It did not turn on even when it definitely should have been on. I manually told it to start charging, I'm not sure if it ever would have.

Tonight it is behaving similar to two nights ago where it will initially show there is a delay, and then a few moments later it will decide to start charging. The car is showing 5 hours to a full charge, the departure time is set to 6:40am (early day tomorrow), and we're well before off peak power.

I disabled and reenabled the departure time, double checked all the settings, but its still doing this.

I have minimum charge level set to 20%, so it shouldn't automatically be charging. I don't want it to at 29 cents/kWh.

So based on my experience since it didn't start charging even when it was "awake" and should have, it could be something with time zones.

That or its horribly broken as someone else suggested.

I haven't had a chance to call VW yet about this.

Paul
---
White/Black 2015 e-Golf
 
cynandvinecar said:
in2insight said:
The issue seems to be that the car itself goes into "sleep" mode and neither the app nor a charger with delayed charging can wake it up.
I'm playing with how long it takes for the car to stop responding.
So far, any "delay" over 2 hours yields a car not being charged

Thanks for the post...like every other issue we're having with the carnet software, owners seem to know more than VW or the carnet " technical help".

I thought I read earlier that someone else had successfully used a EVSE unit with delay to overcome the carnet failure. But to your point, if correct, it may be that persons car wasn't asleep for the 2+hours.

So if I understand what you are saying, we can plug the car in at 10.02 PM and the delay feature will then work to start at midnight.

Will try it out tonight and see what happens, still a software bug, but a bit more usable than staying up until midnight to plug it in!
Follow up to previous post. Plugged car in at 10.15 and lo and behold, a full charge when leaving at 7 am! Going to try 9.30 tonight and see if it still works, will report back what happens.
 
cynandvinecar said:
cynandvinecar said:
in2insight said:
The issue seems to be that the car itself goes into "sleep" mode and neither the app nor a charger with delayed charging can wake it up.
I'm playing with how long it takes for the car to stop responding.
So far, any "delay" over 2 hours yields a car not being charged

Thanks for the post...like every other issue we're having with the carnet software, owners seem to know more than VW or the carnet " technical help".

I thought I read earlier that someone else had successfully used a EVSE unit with delay to overcome the carnet failure. But to your point, if correct, it may be that persons car wasn't asleep for the 2+hours.

So if I understand what you are saying, we can plug the car in at 10.02 PM and the delay feature will then work to start at midnight.

Will try it out tonight and see what happens, still a software bug, but a bit more usable than staying up until midnight to plug it in!
Follow up to previous post. Plugged car in at 10.15 and lo and behold, a full charge when leaving at 7 am! Going to try 9.30 tonight and see if it still works, will report back what happens.

Oh well, no charge this morning, seems like 2 hour threshold is correct. Just had a call from VW customer support, they want to look at the car. Delaying tactics anyone?
 
Thanks for the post...like every other issue we're having with the carnet software, owners seem to know more than VW or the carnet " technical help".

I thought I read earlier that someone else had successfully used a EVSE unit with delay to overcome the carnet failure. But to your point, if correct, it may be that persons car wasn't asleep for the 2+hours.

So if I understand what you are saying, we can plug the car in at 10.02 PM and the delay feature will then work to start at midnight.

Will try it out tonight and see what happens, still a software bug, but a bit more usable than staying up until midnight to plug it in![/quote]
Follow up to previous post. Plugged car in at 10.15 and lo and behold, a full charge when leaving at 7 am! Going to try 9.30 tonight and see if it still works, will report back what happens.[/quote]

Oh well, no charge this morning, seems like 2 hour threshold is correct. Just had a call from VW customer support, they want to look at the car. Delaying tactics anyone?[/quote]


See if you can get a Name and direct phone number for someone, maybe a supervisor, post it, and then we all can call and leave messages.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease!
 
AgentEG said:
Thanks for the post...like every other issue we're having with the carnet software, owners seem to know more than VW or the carnet " technical help".

I thought I read earlier that someone else had successfully used a EVSE unit with delay to overcome the carnet failure. But to your point, if correct, it may be that persons car wasn't asleep for the 2+hours.

So if I understand what you are saying, we can plug the car in at 10.02 PM and the delay feature will then work to start at midnight.

Will try it out tonight and see what happens, still a software bug, but a bit more usable than staying up until midnight to plug it in!
Follow up to previous post. Plugged car in at 10.15 and lo and behold, a full charge when leaving at 7 am! Going to try 9.30 tonight and see if it still works, will report back what happens.[/quote]

Oh well, no charge this morning, seems like 2 hour threshold is correct. Just had a call from VW customer support, they want to look at the car. Delaying tactics anyone?[/quote]


See if you can get a Name and direct phone number for someone, maybe a supervisor, post it, and then we all can call and leave messages.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease![/quote]
AgentEG said:
Thanks for the post...like every other issue we're having with the carnet software, owners seem to know more than VW or the carnet " technical help".

I thought I read earlier that someone else had successfully used a EVSE unit with delay to overcome the carnet failure. But to your point, if correct, it may be that persons car wasn't asleep for the 2+hours.

So if I understand what you are saying, we can plug the car in at 10.02 PM and the delay feature will then work to start at midnight.

Will try it out tonight and see what happens, still a software bug, but a bit more usable than staying up until midnight to plug it in!
Follow up to previous post. Plugged car in at 10.15 and lo and behold, a full charge when leaving at 7 am! Going to try 9.30 tonight and see if it still works, will report back what happens.[/quote]

Oh well, no charge this morning, seems like 2 hour threshold is correct. Just had a call from VW customer support, they want to look at the car. Delaying tactics anyone?[/quote]


See if you can get a Name and direct phone number for someone, maybe a supervisor, post it, and then we all can call and leave messages.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease![/quote]

Hi AgentEG, can you please let us know if the delay charging has ever worked for you? We got a VW tech assigned and he's pointing the finger at Bosch, the unit THEY recommend. Glad we went that way otherwise we might be completely out of luck. If you still have the problem I will happy to share his information on this site. VW seems to be in denial of this problem. Apparently we're the ONLY ones with this issue. If you have a solution please share that too, we love the car and want it to work but not at the cost of getting up at midnight to plug it in!
 
cynandvinecar said:
Hi AgentEG, can you please let us know if the delay charging has ever worked for you? We got a VW tech assigned and he's pointing the finger at Bosch, the unit THEY recommend. Glad we went that way otherwise we might be completely out of luck. If you still have the problem I will happy to share his information on this site. VW seems to be in denial of this problem. Apparently we're the ONLY ones with this issue. If you have a solution please share that too, we love the car and want it to work but not at the cost of getting up at midnight to plug it in!


Definitely does sound like denial on VW's part. Obviously you're not the only ones having the issue, and I would find it hard to believe that VW and Car-net haven't heard from a good number of owners on this. I have personally reported it to Car-net on multiple occasions, and I also reported it in the quality survey that I received from VW directly.

FWIW, we have a Bosch charger too. Is the VW tech also accusing the charger of arbitrarily changing the departure time setting in Car-net from day to day as well?
 
eGolf2015 said:
cynandvinecar said:
.

FWIW, we have a Bosch charger too. Is the VW tech also accusing the charger of arbitrarily changing the departure time setting in Car-net from day to day as well?

We can shoot down the Tech's W.A.G. in a heartbeat. This not only occurs with the Bosch charger, but also the provided 120v charger, the public ChargePoint chargers and virtually every EVSE. In his mind he probably thinks that an EVSE is some sort of high tech box.

It boils down to this specific question. What does an EVSE need to provide to keep the car from going to sleep? Can he answer that?

EVSE's are very simplistic in design and don't have much technology in them. They provide a pilot voltage along a thin gauge wire that runs inside the charge cord. When plugged in to "communicate" with the car. It's not even some high tech digital signal, just simple constant voltage which the car in turns puts resistance on to trigger that it wants to charge.

I have a OpenEVSE which is very programmable. Whether I provide a constant pilot voltage or delay providing the pilot voltage when a charge delay time lapses, the car still is asleep when the car is programmed to charge via departure time. If he's saying it's the Bosch charger, then he needs to tell us what the Bosch charger is doing wrong.

Sorry for the ranting. It peeves me when paid technicians rather than being helpful, spew drivel and make some completely wrong determination as their conclusion.
 
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